Curse

AceSnyp3r · Jul 24, 2005, 11:05 PM // 23:05

If I had kids, I would be more concerned about them being negatively effected by seeing a person shot full of bullets than seeing the human body

America just seems to be pretty sexually repressed, possibly due in large part to the Christian and Catholic religions and their strong base in American history and culture.

ExplosiveBadger · Jul 24, 2005, 11:05 PM // 23:05

This is stupid. Seriously, mass murder, car jackings, decapitation, gang violence, and even excessive blood. But throw in a little sex. And it gets an AO.

Society is screwed up.

I'm glad the game will be changed back to an M rating in August when they take out the Hot Coffee mod. More people need to play this awesome game.

Imp · Aug 15, 2005, 11:42 AM // 11:42

Don't worry Jack thompson is out of his mind, you can see here.

http://gr.bolt.com/articles/jack/jack.htm

also i made my own drawing here.

http://www.paleghost.com/images/jts.jpg

Also read about what he has done in the past here

http://www.netjak.com/review.php/357

This man insults you if you e-mail him and will not even listen to you.

Kassad · Aug 15, 2005, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Hes on crack

BrandonIT · Aug 15, 2005, 04:09 PM // 16:09

Well, I can't say anything about the guy the OP is quoting.

GTA was targeted because their sex act was hard-coded into their game. They created it, then released it in the game with the knowledge (or at least suspicion) that it would be cracked. The artwork, voice-acting, and scenery were all created and completely finished when the game was released. The "mod" that unlocked it added nothing to the game, it merely 'flipped the bit' that allowed it to be seen.

I am not aware of the exact "mod" required to view the Sims naked. I have seen screenshots of what is available, and yes it is what most would consider "pornographic" (meaning 'the depiction of erotic behavior (as in pictures or writing) intended to cause sexual excitement').

BUT, it was my understanding that the mod ADDED to the game the textures and skins required. If that is the case, then this is NOT the same as GTA, and therefore, no re-rating is required. It would be the same as running the "nude-Raider" mod for Tomb Raider, and trying to blame that on Eidos.

If the "nude-sim" mod however does nothing but 'flip the bit' to allow the nudity to be seen, and all the skins and textures were already in the game, then EA made the same mistake Rockstar did, and the game should be re-rated accordingly, since there was absolutely no need for the artwork, programming, and voices to be included in the software if they could not be accessed.

That is my opinion.

Guild Wars will never have this problem since their "streaming patching system" means, even if they did include the textures and such for skin underneath our garments, they could remove it from the game with a simple patch downloaded to our systems, without us ever being aware it was in in the first place.

Loviatar · Aug 15, 2005, 04:19 PM // 16:19

as one game industry person said rockstar screwed it for the rest of us

the whole point of the game rating system is to prove that the industry can and will police itself the same as the movie industry for the specific purpose of keeping the government from doing it for them

rockstar submitted false information to the game rating people by withholding critical game information that would have changed the rating given to the game

anything that falls out from this in the govt taking over the regulation blame rockstar for giving them the excuse to do it

Ambre Finian · Aug 15, 2005, 07:38 PM // 19:38

Bah all of this (including the actions of Jack Thompson) are only "swiping at the branches" rather than getting at the "trunk" of the problem. In my opinion PARENTS and guardians need to take an active role with their children, sheesh. Stop letting the TV and gameboxes raise your kids, good grief! Get them outside and living!
Don't buy games for you kids unless you KNOW what's what.
Don't just blindly give your kids access to tv and let the government and the media decide, ignorantly, what YOUR own kids can watch.

So, to me, that's the heart of the true problem, not the games.

Anya · Aug 15, 2005, 07:54 PM // 19:54

I'd like to see this guy try and take his fight to Japan ... he'd just get laughed out of the country =)

Imp · Aug 15, 2005, 08:18 PM // 20:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrandonIT

If the "nude-sim" mod however does nothing but 'flip the bit' to allow the nudity to be seen, and all the skins and textures were already in the game, then EA made the same mistake Rockstar did, and the game should be re-rated accordingly, since there was absolutely no need for the artwork, programming, and voices to be included in the software if they could not be accessed.

I read an article saying the same thing. He said something along the line of how the companys are trying to get by with a lower ESRP rating. If you are going to put material in there that is going to make the game a AO, then do it already, don't do it AFTER you get your rating. That is like selling an 'E' game and then finding out there is a way to unlock cuss words and blood.

BrandonIT · Aug 15, 2005, 10:55 PM // 22:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ambre Finian

In my opinion PARENTS and guardians need to take an active role with their children...Don't buy games for you kids unless you KNOW what's what.

Parents had no way of knowing what their children could do with "The Sims". That game was rated "T" for teen which I believe covers 12 and up. There is no excuse for a game of that rating to have the nude artwork included in it, even it was 'initially' not available.

(yes, a parent could've hacked the game, or looked for every mod that might be available and make sure it's not offensive as well, but there is a reasonable amount of 'due diligence' that should be expected of parents, remember they have lives/jobs/spouses too.)

Additionally, any teenager can buy a "T" game, whereas they can (SHOULD) not purchase an "M" rated game.

Which is why for parental oversight, GTA is beside the point, it was "M". If you bought it for your children under 17 knowingly, you made a mistake and should not complain about what was found. But that game was already straddling the line on AO rating which CERTAINLY would've kept people from buying the games for their children, or even at all.

Here, the publishers' hand needs to be slapped hard enough where all the industry feels it, and remembers the next time they want to submit just the 'available' content for rating...

Baratus · Aug 15, 2005, 11:47 PM // 23:47

I'd like to show this guy Daggerfall, the second in the Elder Scrolls series. YOu could dress or undress your character including under-garments. Yeah baby, those 256-color 2D sprites in 640x480 back in DOS would truly set him on fire. Where was this asshole when I was being called a devil-worshipper because I played Doom, Heretic, and Hexen? He's targetting shit that is just stupid. I can't believe he's targetting the Sims. I have no desire to play those games, but what he's saying is that we need to recall not only the Sims, but also every freaking Barbie doll because apparently a smooth model is still sexual in some way o_O.

Ambre Finian · Aug 16, 2005, 12:06 AM // 00:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrandonIT

Parents had no way of knowing what their children could do with "The Sims". That game was rated "T" for teen which I believe covers 12 and up. There is no excuse for a game of that rating to have the nude artwork included in it, even it was 'initially' not available.

It's obvious I'm going to disagree here, which is definitely fine. But I'm not singling you out, please understand. I don't agree that parents had NO way of knowing what their children could do with that game in particular. The description on the box is not extremely vague and should inspire questions about the game content. If a parent is not technically savvy enough to do some online research, they could ask a trusted friend to help out (who is savvy). They could do some research, for example, using google and see what feedback is out there already. Wait for the game to mature a few months so that feedback can actually show up online.
Like I said before, and what I hinted to before, our media is really bonkers, I mean REALLY crazy. I feel that in itself is going to make their rating systems at least equally bonkers. And, as we can see, the rating system isn't too precise.
It may tie into a few bits of cultural lag we having going on today. WE, as humans in THIS society, apparently don't want our kids exposed to things which may be inappropriate. Yet our media(tv, radio, ads, etc) says otherwise. Our media reflects that people are watching and reading inappropriate material and sales are being generated due to that.
The media image is extremely influential to all aspects of our society, especially games, movies, and, yes, even their ratings.
The bottom line, in my opinion, is that parents have their work cut out for them in this age if they do really want to keep a healthy atmosphere. Reading the rating isn't going to cut it unfortunately.
Sure, it's inconvenient to parents with busy lifestyles, but what else can you do? The current system obviously isn't working.

Side related note:
Canceling tv subscriptions would be awesome. I know I use my tv only to show movies. The ads today are amazingly terrible. Not to mention how they take over nearly half of a shows contents these days; Talk about lowering our children's attention spans!

smurfhunter · Aug 16, 2005, 12:11 AM // 00:11

yea GW is constantly being updated so were this to hit, the gw staff could be smart and quickly patch it before it got any real attention.

however i think thompson is just using his momentum from GTA to go after other companies. i dont think he cares about the nudity, i think he just like the attention and the money.

so screw him

Spartan2 · Aug 16, 2005, 01:40 AM // 01:40

I believe this Jack is just trying to revive that old school "Pure Beliefs" reform movement that died out a while back.

Anyway, Rockstar and the ESRB has gotten their hands stuck in the cookie jar; it is time for a good ol' reform in the game industry. This is how I see how the ratings should be:

L: Learning material games for toddlers, pre-schoolers, early elementary children to help with eye coordination. This is the game industry's equivelant to Sesame Street and Barney.

E: Material that is suited to everyone. This includes little to no violence, absolutely no explitives or adult-themes. (Fantasy type action such as the Power Rangers with no blood would be deemed okay in this catagory.)

T: Material suited to the ages of 12-13+. Contains more violence than E, may contain blood, a few explitives, but absolutely no adult-themes or motifs.

M: Material suited for the ages of 15-16. Contains a significant amount of violence, blood, gore, explitives, and minor adult-themes and motifs. (Current industry standard M rating brought down 1 to 2 years but enforcing the ratings to keep adult-themed No-Nos down to a minimum.)

Ao: Welcome to adult-hood 18 year-olds! You can now officially vote, smoke, visit strip-clubs, and view pornography, so why limit you on what you can play? Adult-Only games include everything a mature game has but has a significant amount of adult-themes and motifs running throughout the game. A game of this calibre does not hold anything back graphic-wise or story-wise, but, you get what you are paying for.

Lampshade · Aug 16, 2005, 01:48 AM // 01:48

Taking on EA is crazy. Im sure they could get

1 G4TV (Adam Sessler and Morgan Webb openly dissing him again?)
2 Every single game studio (they own a lot of them)
3 Microsoft (wont even go there)
4 Every single gaming organization (including clans/guilds)

The most important thing is PARENTS. He says that the content is not suitable for kids. KIDS ARNT BUYING SAN ANDREAS, PARENTS ARE
Parents see that the content is not suitable for kids and they buy it anyway.
personally this pisses me off cause I have seen parents buy M games and hand them to their kids at the counter. "Oh you want this game with the man blowing somones head off for your 10 birthday?Ok Little Jimmy!"
This guy needs to be scilenced.

Go take on Korea or Japan.

meep meep · Aug 16, 2005, 01:51 AM // 01:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by AceSnyp3r

If I had kids, I would be more concerned about them being negatively effected by seeing a person shot full of bullets than seeing the human body

America just seems to be pretty sexually repressed, possibly due in large part to the Christian and Catholic religions and their strong base in American history and culture.

Couldn't have said it better my self.

Porkchop Sandwhiches · Aug 16, 2005, 04:36 AM // 04:36

This man has no life.

Akilles · Aug 16, 2005, 04:43 AM // 04:43

The game industry makes to much money, politicians will pretend to make a face at the industry to save face, but a multi-billion dollar industry (especially from the sequel to the biggest PC game of all time) will never be stoped. GTA will still have more titles. The idiot politicians (like Hilary Clinton) who try to stop the games are trying to please older voters and honetly could care less. PLEASE remember that the gamer generation now votes and every year that number increases ALOT!

Guillaume De Sonoma · Aug 16, 2005, 04:46 AM // 04:46

My thoughts are that
1) He has no case against EA but what he did to GTA was acceptable because of its content.
2) He is an idiot with old christian values.
3) Some one said that they would like to see him go up against Microsoft. That would be a pretty one-sided battle which I would enjoy
4) The video game industry is the fastest growing industry in the world and this man cannot conquer it

derrtyboy69 · Aug 16, 2005, 04:54 AM // 04:54

as carlos mencia said : and old woman is sueing because there is an unlockable sex scene in the game (the guy still has his pants on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!), but doesnt give a shit that you can murder thousand of cops, civilians etc.